No one knows what the situation will be five years from now
A discussion with Wim Pijbes, director of the Rijksmuseum
MúzeumCafé 43.
“You start a project now, planning for five years, but no one knows what the situation will be in 2020. You have to imagine what the future will bring.” So says Wim Pijbes, director of the Rijksmuseum in Amsterdam and co-chair of the architectural jury for Liget Budapest. The Dutch art historian knows his subject. The protracted reconstruction of the Rijksmuseum occurred in the very heart of Amsterdam’s shrine of the arts, but with his leadership the work was successfully completed. Pijbes believes that the role of museums is changing. A national museum has to be the best in many respects, but today people don’t accept the absolutism of major institutes. As a member of the jury Wim Pijbes could not speak about the Budapest museum quarter itself, but he spoke to MúzeumCafé about the idea of a museum quarter and the potential conceptions and challenges of such districts.
– You studied art history, film and philosophy. Why did you choose the museum profession?
Clearly art history relates most closely to my current work, but I still enjoy what I learnt about philosophy or, say, music. Regarding art history, I primarily focussed on architecture. I’m not a painting specialist, rather I lean towards architectural history. In this sense I have greatly profited from my studies.
– What did you feel when you became the head of one of the most important institutes of Dutch art history?
The first thing I had to deal with was the Rijksmuseum’s reconstruction project. In the first five years I was greatly occupied with the construction process so that the place would be ready for the reopening. Since that happened in 2013, I’ve been able at last to work as a real museum director.
– In 2008 the renovation project was well under way. How did it all start?
The main aims had already been defined in 1999. The museum had to be made appropriate for the 21st century. The building was old, the air-conditioning system was antiquated, the spaces for the museum services were small, while the number of visitors was growing. The museum wasn’t equipped to receive a continuously rising number of visitors and it didn’t function in a manner expected of a modern museum. The services themselves were not good enough. The Rijksmuseum is an old building. It was built in 1885 and needed to be renovated, which took ten years.
– The work needed ten years as opposed the originally planned five. Earlier you declared that this delay was scandalous.
It is my definite opinion that to keep a national museum closed for years is too long. A whole generation of artists, children and art lovers were not able to become acquainted with the major part of the national collection.
– Yet have there been any similar projects in the world which were completed on time?
Generally speaking such projects are always much more complicated than envisaged. Many elements are involved in the work: public opinion, the art world, politics – which can change a lot in the course of a few years – as well as museum directors. A five-year project involves too long a time. It’s a risky undertaking. And something else … technology can also change. You have to imagine what the future will bring.
– What kind of debates were there among those participating in the Rijksmuseum’s renovation project?
Conservatives and progressives, puritans and visionaries of the museum world, scientists and people with business acumen all argued with each other. There were certainly lots of different opinions about how a museum should function. In part, this is very good since it seems that everyone is committed to the museum. This is the national museum, so teachers, artists and art lovers feel they have an interest in the matter. There are newspaper articles and political lobbies which bring some tension to the processes. One thing is central for dealing with this: a strong capacity for leadership, such that you know in advance where you want to go and what the final outcome will be. Strong leadership is essential and right from the start you have to identify the outcome.
– Were there lots of compromises on the part of those in dispute?
It’s worth avoiding compromises. If you make too many compromises you’re not going to have a strong result.
– Renovation of the Rijksmuseum cost 370 million euros, most of which came from the state. There are always disputes about how the state or the government should (or should not) interfere in such projects.
The Dutch model is different from the Hungarian one. The museum is independent, it’s not a state institution. The state owns the building and the collection, but the institution itself is an independent foundation. Hence to a certain degree we are independent in terms of what we should exhibit and how. The state doesn’t participate in the formation of the collection and other related matters. We have a lot of freedom. Yet the money comes from the cultural ministry and the ministry dealing with real estate was responsible for the renovation project. So it’s complicated since right away we have three participants: the Rijksmuseum itself and the two ministries.
– Was there always political support behind the project?
Sure, since at the start there was agreement about the final aims and the finances. Most problems appeared on the local level, with Amsterdam, with neighbouring buildings, with cyclists, and the complicated EU tender also demanded a lot of time.
– It is always a sensitive matter when the redesign of a national institute is done by foreign architects.
In the Netherlands there are many international architectural tenders, the tender for reconstruction of the Rijksmuseum was one of those. You can have renowned international architects in a project, but in addition you have to have a local agency which helps them.
– The Rijksmuseum isn’t alone in the city. It stands in Museum Square, which is Amsterdam’s museum quarter. What do you think of the concept of a museum quarter?
There are a number of places in the world where cultural institutes are concentrated. A museum quarter can certainly show the world that it is in fact the cultural centre of a city. In Amsterdam we work together and thus there’s a strong message that cultural life is concentrated in this quarter. With the public space and the green area.